Is Manual Setup component needed when installing from boot?
- Thread starter chrcol
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Manual Setup is needed for running a live in-place upgrade, where you mount the ISO and run the root folder's Setup.exe from the desktop or a command shell. If you intend to perform a host refresh using this ISO as a source, it's required since a refresh is really a "repair install".
For a pure clean install, it's optional. If you hover over the Extra info column, NTLite will list all the Compatibility modes blocking its removal.
For a pure clean install, it's optional. If you hover over the Extra info column, NTLite will list all the Compatibility modes blocking its removal.
Yes it says something different was blocking it (not upgrade, host refresh), from your answer it looks like a ntlite bug on compatibility flags.
It is blocked by "setup and deployment", not just recommended, but now I know why, it makes clean install fail at 10% right after choosing disk to install.
Here is a post by nuhi. Seems a new issue in 24H2, I will ask him to update the description so its clearer on 24H2 its needed for clean boot, not just for upgrade/repair install.
Here is a post by nuhi. Seems a new issue in 24H2, I will ask him to update the description so its clearer on 24H2 its needed for clean boot, not just for upgrade/repair install.
The clarification is if you're using the newer 24H2 WinPE Setup client, then it requires Manual Setup. If you've switched in Settings to the legacy Setup client, it doesn't require Manual Setup.
New Setup runs as a Windows "upgrade", even on a clean disk. Old Setup is the expected behavior it's always been before 24H2.
New Setup runs as a Windows "upgrade", even on a clean disk. Old Setup is the expected behavior it's always been before 24H2.
Whats the difference between the two clients other than what you mentioned, or is that the only difference?
This might explain why I had a empty Windows.old directory, which I thought was odd for a clean install.
I see a boot/legacy option which has no documentation in ntlite, so the default behaviour is still to need the manual setup on clean setup, so in that respect I think I am not wrong, in that a updated description would help users here. My suggestion is either to add a popup suggesting that this legacy setup should be enabled, if someone unticks the manual setup box, or make it enabled automatically if someone unticks the manual setup.
This might explain why I had a empty Windows.old directory, which I thought was odd for a clean install.
I see a boot/legacy option which has no documentation in ntlite, so the default behaviour is still to need the manual setup on clean setup, so in that respect I think I am not wrong, in that a updated description would help users here. My suggestion is either to add a popup suggesting that this legacy setup should be enabled, if someone unticks the manual setup box, or make it enabled automatically if someone unticks the manual setup.
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MS has never bothered to explain why they suddenly decided in 24H2 to replace the default Setup client. It's probably related to BitLocker security and requiring WinRE.
New or "Modern" Setup is essentially what happens when you're on a live system and run an in-place upgrade as SetupPrep. For a clean install on a blank disk, it actually creates an empty Windows.old folder so it can pretend it's an "upgrade".
You can find online threads where IT admins complain "but my updated install image worked for 23H2, why doesn't 24H2 work?". And if you switch back to the legacy client, it works again without any user changes.
Modern Setup is known for these differences:
New or "Modern" Setup is essentially what happens when you're on a live system and run an in-place upgrade as SetupPrep. For a clean install on a blank disk, it actually creates an empty Windows.old folder so it can pretend it's an "upgrade".
You can find online threads where IT admins complain "but my updated install image worked for 23H2, why doesn't 24H2 work?". And if you switch back to the legacy client, it works again without any user changes.
Modern Setup is known for these differences:
- Requires WinRE.wim not be missing from your image, and you must have a recovery partition if using a disk layout.
- Requires Manual Setup component as a dependency.
- Lists more disk devices than before in the Disk Layout screen (including the USB drive you're installing from??).
- Creates an empty Windows.old folder. If you're performing sysprep, don't forget to remove Windows.old before you generalize or capture the image.
- Errors out when installing some sysprepped images, but doesn't really tell you onscreen why it doesn't like them.
- May not like some unattended Run commands, which are logged as executed, but don't exactly do what they're supposed to.
- Because it runs as an "upgrade" experience, your install progress indicators are different.
Ok thank you.
So I flipped it off again, will turn on legacy setup.
To flip it off I had to remove compatibility safety for setup and deployment, and now this shows on top of the apply screen, but if I dont remove any oobe component (the only one I have removed is manual setup) can I ignore this?
So I flipped it off again, will turn on legacy setup.
To flip it off I had to remove compatibility safety for setup and deployment, and now this shows on top of the apply screen, but if I dont remove any oobe component (the only one I have removed is manual setup) can I ignore this?
You know you can just try building the image. If you got a long preset, start over with a clean image and only remove Manual Setup & switch to legacy Setup. This way you can quickly confirm if that combination is safe to install.
francis11
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Checking to Legacy Setup let you remove WinRE and Manuel Setup as it's not needed.
In the new 24H2 setup MS is forcing a backupartition during install to support their new (forced) backup app function in Windows.
If you've other backup tools - stick to legacy option and it'll still work.
In the new 24H2 setup MS is forcing a backupartition during install to support their new (forced) backup app function in Windows.
If you've other backup tools - stick to legacy option and it'll still work.
What is this "backup app"? 24H2 wants you to create a Recovery partition, since BitLocker or Device Encryption (which a limited form of BitLocker) is enabled on a clean install. WinRE is the default repair environment in case something goes wrong with BitLocker.
WinPE out of the box doesn't support BitLocker. It can be optionally added from the Windows ADK PE Add-on's. Setup installs a Windows image which is BitLocker-aware, and BitLocker doesn't enable itself until the install reaches the specialize pass.
WinRE is an image which share components with WinPE, but has additional features out of the box.
If you want to ignore the requirement for a Recovery partition, it's your responsibility to build your own bootable USB repair drive or create a dual-boot setup with another copy of Windows. Not everything can be fixed by booting into Safe Mode.
Ahaa, thats very nice bit of info, thank you. I got caught up fighting UI issues, but going to go ahead, and make sure what I done so far is working. Then get back to tweaking.
The new installer is much slower as well, about 2-3 secs delay when clicking on drive options, and the initial install % takes longer to progress as well before first reboot.
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Correction to my original reply, I think its ok, the latter part of the installation looked very different, and I first thought it didnt run some post setup commands, as it took a while for the LAN icon to change to no internet. But seems things are ok.
Still struggling with some things, but it does install.
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Note that this is the case for the Pro, for the Home, BL is not activated by default (still seen no later than last week on a clean installation of the 24h2 Home)
Home edition gets Device Encryption, which is BitLocker (under a different name) without allowing you to change most of the encryption settings. The reg key and unattended file setting to disable the default protection is the same on all editions.
Windows checks if your device should be encrypted based on Secure Boot settings, and HW markers that are read from UEFI. 24H2 relaxes more of the restrictions, so it's intended to enable BitLocker across a wider range of PC's. Older machines may not trigger auto-encryption.
Since MS is aggressively pushing out BitLocker/Device Encryption out of the box, Setup checks if WinRE is present.
Windows checks if your device should be encrypted based on Secure Boot settings, and HW markers that are read from UEFI. 24H2 relaxes more of the restrictions, so it's intended to enable BitLocker across a wider range of PC's. Older machines may not trigger auto-encryption.
Since MS is aggressively pushing out BitLocker/Device Encryption out of the box, Setup checks if WinRE is present.